How to learn Kanji?

[arkazain9006]

Right now, I'm pretty much done learning the kana, so I thought I'd start with the actual audio lessons, specifically Newbie Season 2.
However, I'm not really sure how I should learn the Kanji... Any tips? There seems to be a lot of different ways, so it's kind of difficult to know what to do.

Thanks in advance!

EDIT:
Oh, and while I'm at it, how exactly should I learn with the audio lessons? Sorry if this sounds like a weird question, but how should I "use" them? Should I listen to a new lesson everyday or...? What should I do after listening to a lesson?

[mewes6190]

arkazain-san,

hello and welcome to the forums!

As for the Kanji learning, that's a tricky one, because it's such a complex task, that everyone has to find it's own way. So, at best you try out a bit.

Me personally, I don't believe, that a grown up person with another native language can learn Kanji the way japanese kids do, because those already know the language when they start learning the Kanji. As a foreigner, you usually learn the language and the Kanji at the same time.
At first: No matter what: It's work, and it takes time. Simply reject any idea or system, that promises you a quick and easy way, to cram 2300+ of alien signs with different readings into your brain. Unless your blessed with an eiditic memory, it won't work.

Here's MY way, which I can recommend.
Start with the Heisig method. James W. Heisig published two (main) books. "Remembering the Kanji I" shows you a lot of mnemonics, to learn the WRITING and MEANING of the Joujou-Kanji, the 2200+ Main Kanji recommend for reading Newspaper and stuff.
The second book, "Remembering the Kanji II" shows you the On Reading and has some helps for the Kun-readings.
Anyway, the second book isn't so much different from all the other Kanji books out there.
The first on the other hand can(!) be a big help. I recommend, working it through, slowly and concentrated. I took 3,5 Months daily studies for it.
You won't be able to read much after it, since you don't know the readings of the Kanji, but it has 3 strong points, spending that time:
a) you lose any fear you might have had of Kanji. You simply spend a lot of time with a lot of Kanji, breaking them down into little peaces, until they become quite familiar.
b) you learn a lot of helps for remembering the meaning
c) you learn how to write Kanji. A lot. Many of them!

At the end, most likely you won't remember all 2200+ Kanji you learned here, At least I didn't, but it's still a good base for the next step:

Simply learn japanese vocabulary!
When you start learning the language, and you build up Vocabulary, you'll learn the Kanji automatically. And HERE all the work with Heisig will pay off, since in the end, you will remember faster, which Kanji build up which word, and the Knot from Meaning-Kanji-Vocabulary quickly make sense in your head.
You'll learn the reading autmatically, when you learn the vocabulary.

I strictly recommend, learning the Kanji in context with their Words. What good does it to you, to know, that 望 has the reading "ぼう" and "もう" and means "wish", when you stumble upon words like 希望, 大望, 要望? You'll have to learn no matter what, that these words are きぼう, たいもう and ようぼう.

So, any second spent on studying Kanji is a good one. But you should study and learn them in context, with vocabulary. The Heisig method might be a good base for this work, maybe not. The method doesn't work for everyone.

So, this is MY way of slowly clawing my way up the 山 of 漢字.

Maybe for you another one fits better. Just try it out, but expect it to take time. And effort. But it's also very rewarding!
Oh, and one more thing: In the beginning, it's kinda frustrating, slow going and seems like a neverending issue. Keep on it though, with time, as you grow more competent and secure in Japanese in general, a lot of what seems ridiculously random at first, looks a lot more logical later on, and the more you know and learn, the easier and quicker it gets to learn new stuff. Learning Kanji starts with a steep curve, but it gets easier the farther you come.

Good luck and much fun,
くろくま

[R3belD0gg]

I have nothing much to add to what arkazain9006 has said, as it was very good advice. I will mention a few things just from my POV, though. First, I must admit that I am still a beginner and can't read Kanji either! But here's my perspective anyway, and what has helped me.

First off, if you have Firefox (not sure if there is one for other browsers or not, buy maybe) get the add on Rikaichan. You right click on a page and hover your mouse over Japanese words, a blue box comes up with different readings and definitions. Right click and use the context menu again to disable (as it can be bothersome if left on.) I use this a LOT. Even when reading the PDFs for the lessons, as the kanji and kana sections are separate. It's better to read the kanji section with the audio and use Rikaichan to define the unknown kanji as you come across them.

I have the Heisig book mentioned above and it is very good. That said it's also one of the main reasons I burned myself out learning Japanese a few years ago. I recently started again and this time I'm not focusing so hard on Kanji. Rather than spending hours and hours with the characters, stroke order, readings, etc... I'm just learning the kanji along with my vocabulary. It's not the best way, I guess, but it's more productive for me.

Eventually you'll see certain characters in multiple words and the readings start to stick that way. For example, you'll see 夏子さん's name often. 夏　is a common vocabulary word for summer (natsu) and 子　（ko） means child.　調子　（choushi) is a condition or state of health. Notice 子 can be KO or SHI. 今年 is this year (ko-toshi, but not 子年！）今　is now, so now year, though the readings for 今　are いま (ima) and きん/こん (kin/kon), not こ (ko)。今週　(kon-shu) is now week, . All of this sounds super complicated, but by learning the vocabulary and the kanji that goes with it, it all makes sense. Kind of. So far.

One thing that has helped me is reading lyrics to simple pop songs along with the music. I'm a musician, so maybe that has something to do with it, but I find memorizing lyrics also triggers memorization of the kanji that goes with the words, for the most part. Better than flashcards (though use those, as well!) I often struggle with understanding what's being said, even if I know the words because the logic and grammar aren't there for me. But the words stick, and it's fun. That's important. Don't burn yourself out, this isn't a race. I learned that the hard way.

Lastly, and this is something I need to get on as well, learn about the kanji radicals (or components.) This was part of the Heisig method. You'll notice that all kanji are made up of components. You may see the same shapes and combinations in several different kanji, for example 女 (woman) is found in many kanji or as a kanji itself. 婦人 (fujin hito) is "woman person." Or woman. 好き (suki), to like. See the woman and child in the first character? Woman LOVES child.

Okay, this turned out a bit long so I'll end here.

One more thing... How you listen to the lessons is all on you. I flew through the whole newbie series (don't worry it doesn't all stick, each season goes over the basics again... and again... and again...) then the beginner series will cover all of the newbie series again. I drive a truck for a living and just listen and repeat back the dialog all day long. If I have trouble with something, I listen again until I get it down.

Half way or so through the beginner season 1 (looooong season compared to Newbie!!! 170 lessons 420 audio files!!!) I felt I was rushing too much. I now listen to two or so new lessons a day, then recap the last few so each lesson gets heard at least 2-3 times. I may skip through the lesson a bit where they are talking about things other than grammar or the dialog on subsequent listens. But listen to that dialog track over and over and speak along with it. Picture the scene being played out and try not to think of the English translation but just understand the Japanese (tough, I know.) Biggest thing, and something I don't do enough, read the dang PDF. See the kanji, follow the dialog word for word. The line by line is great on the site, I just wish they had an app that would let me use those features on the go.

Okay, done for real now. One parting piece of advice: DON'T BURN OUT. Don't stress. Take breaks. Don't beat yourself up if you don't feel like studying one day. Play a game. Drink a beer. Watch a movie. This isn't a race.

[arkazain9006]

Wow, thanks for the advice guys!
Just one more thing, should I try to do the Heisig stuff first, or can I do that and listen to the audio lessons at the same time?

[Tracel]

Hi Arkazain9006,

The other posts have some great ideas for learning kanji and listening. Don't hesitate to ask questions here, because everyone has different experiences and tools that they have found to help them learn Japanese. I have been studying for years and have just learned about the following:

First off, if you have Firefox (not sure if there is one for other browsers or not, buy maybe) get the add on Rikaichan. You right click on a page and hover your mouse over Japanese words, a blue box comes up with different readings and definitions. Right click and use the context menu again to disable (as it can be bothersome if left on.) I use this a LOT. Even when reading the PDFs for the lessons, as the kanji and kana sections are separate. It's better to read the kanji section with the audio and use Rikaichan to define the unknown kanji as you come across them.

Thank you R3belD0gg for this advice. I use Firefox, and I didn't know that there was such a great app for it. I can see myself using this a lot.

I advise that you learn as holistically as you can, meaning that you learn to read, write, and speak and listen all together. Each task helps you with learning the others. Reading and writing usually goes quite slowly for everyone, but please do not get discouraged.

Learning the radicals is very helpful for me too. I did not use a specific book to do this, but have learned the Kanji that appear in the lessons that I am studying by making up stories with the radicals. Just like the kanji for 好き、to like, as R3belD0gg suggests is made up of the radicals for woman and child. You have to get creative sometimes as the Kanji represent more and more complex and arbitrary ideas.

One other thing that may help you, is that kanji are often made up of katakana characters. This is another incentive for learning katakana. Sometimes these katakana may give you an idea about how to pronounce the kanji if you need to look it up.

There are lots of apps for Japanese learning, both on Apples devices, and PC based computer software. For example, I have a really cool dictionary for my i-phone and i-pad that allows me to hand-write the kanji into the interface to look it up. But if you don't have that you will need to look it up the old fashioned way; by radical or by sound.

Good luck, and keep at it.

トラ

[R3belD0gg]

Hi Arkazain9006,

There are lots of apps for Japanese learning, both on Apples devices, and PC based computer software. For example, I have a really cool dictionary for my i-phone and i-pad that allows me to hand-write the kanji into the interface to look it up. But if you don't have that you will need to look it up the old fashioned way; by radical or by sound.

Good luck, and keep at it.

トラ

The app Tracel is referring to is called Japanese. That's it, just Japanese on the iPhone. Buy it. Now. Great app. See my recommendation in the other forum on this site. If you don't have an iDevice (not sure if it's on iPad or not...) there are other options, I'm sure. Here is a web site I use often that will allow you to search kanji by handwriting:

http://kanji.sljfaq.org/

Once I've identified an unknown kanji, I highlight and copy it, then use:

http://jisho.org/words/

which is great for looking up Japanese words as well as kanji info (stroke order, readings, meanings, etc...)

The handwriting thing is somewhat forgiving but if you don't get the stroke order correct it may not know what you're trying to look up. I use a pen and tablet rather than mouse, but not everyone will have this. A mouse works fine. Mess around with the other options on there, as well. I just noticed the "four corners" method the other night. New to me... Interesting, though.

[mewes6190]

Wow, thanks for the advice guys!
Just one more thing, should I try to do the Heisig stuff first, or can I do that and listen to the audio lessons at the same time?

Hey there,

if you wanna take a look at the Heisig method, you can do it no matter what, because you won't learn any readings or words or actual japanese. It's simply a way to introduce you to mnenomics and visual methods, to remember the writing and meaning of the Kanji.
So, it won't interfere with any learning you're doing. It's more like trying to learn how to remember 2000 pictures or short stories.

Best
Kurokuma

[community.japanese]

arkazain9006-san, くろくまさん、R3belD0gg-san, トラさん、
こんにちは
I just want to say... thank you very much for the very friendly thread with kind helps, everyone!

Natsuko (奈津子),
Team JapanesePod101.com