Substitutes for 'desu' in casual/informal situations?

[rlankins1122286]

Hey! I'm just wondering if, rather than removing desu all together, there were any substitutes for it in casual situations. I often hear 'dai yo' (or something that sounds like that), which I assume is informal way of saying 'desu yo'. So is there a similar way to say phrases such as: desu, desu ka, desu ne and so on.

(Also, I've read that Japanese hasn't really got a future tense, but that it's merged with the present tense, however I wonder how they ask for things such as, 'I will do it', 'It will be (adjective)', 'I must do that' etc.)

Thank you for answering and reading my question!

[mewes6190]

Hello riankins,

and welcome to the forums!

I'll try to answer your questions.

For the first one: Often, desu is very ommitable and only added for politeness. So, often you regulate the politenesslevel by choosing either the plain form (taberu) or the masu form (tabemasu) of a verb. Sometimes you add desu to the plain form to get a plain sentence polite again. especially, I think, in negative sentences. So, you could say "daidokoro ni arimasen" with the masu-form of negaitve-aru so say politely "it's not in the kitchen". You might also say "daidokoro ni nai" (plain-form of negative-aru) to say "It's not in the kitchen" on a more informal level. You might also say "daidokoro ni naindesu", which combines the nai with no desu, and leveling it on a more polite level.

So, often you can omit desu and automatically get more casual.
Anyway: The plain form of desu is da! So, you simply might say da instead of desu, and also get more casual that way.

As for your second question: Very often it's only knowable from context, if you're talking about the present or the future.
Anyway, sometimes it's visible from the grammatical structure. One often cited example is kekkon suru (marrying).
If you want to say, that you ARE married, you have to use the te-imasu structure: "kekkon shiteimasu" would mean, that your ARE married right now.
kekkonshimasu on the other hand would mean, that you are GOING to get married.

So, with habitual, regular or ongoing situations, often the teimasu form shows the present, while anorthr non-past form often indicates a future event.

That's for my thoughts, hopefully someone else will add his thoughts!

Best
kurokuma

[thegooseking]

rlankins-san, kurokuma-san,

Let's look at the formal phrase:-
Tenki wa samui desu. - The weather is cold.

If I were going to make this informal, there are two ways I would do it.
Tenki wa samui.
or
Samui da.

In the former case, I'm still making it clear that I'm talking about the weather, so I just drop the 'desu'. In the latter case, it's implied that I'm talking about the weather, so I use the informal copula. It's a little complicated because there are different levels of implication. If we were already talking about the weather, I could just say 'Samui." - "it is cold", but the referent of 'it' is something previous in the conversation. But if we weren't already talking about the weather, I would say "Samui da." The 'da' here could be translated as "it is", but with a referent that wasn't previously specified - it's just obvious that I'm talking about the weather.

However, the full plain form would be:-
Tenki wa samui da.
I wouldn't use this so much in informal situations, but I would if formal grammar called for the plain form, e.g.:-
Tenki wa samui da, to omoimasu. - I think the weather is cold (polite).

I have to say all this is based more on feeling than knowledge, though. (Also, saying "Samui desu." without making it clear that you're talking about the weather is also perfectly good polite Japanese, but the point is that informally, I use the copula when the subject/topic is implied.)

Regards,
小狼

[thegooseking]

As for future tense, you can use the volitional form to say "I will do something". The plain volitional form is the -ou/-you ending, and the polite volitional form is replacing -masu with -mashou. Note, however, you can only use this for things you intend to do, not for things that are just going to happen whether you intend it or not. (This form also acts as a suggestion: "Let's do this." - whether it's a suggestion or a volitional statement is really down to context.)
Ikimashou. I intend to go. / Let's go.

Japanese doesn't really have a literal way of saying "I must do that" - the constructions for obligation are more literally like "Not doing that is no good".
Benkyou shinai wa dame desu. - I must study. ("Not studying is no good.")
Tabenai wa ikemasen. - I must eat. ("Not eating does not go well.")
Kaeranakereba narimasen. - I must return. ("If I do not return, no success.")

As for "it will be", this is really contextual. Normally if you have a conditional, the result will be future tense, e.g.:-
Benkyou sureba, seiseki ga ii desu. - If I study, my grade will be good. (Because "If I study, my grade is good" doesn't really make much sense unless you're talking in general terms, and whether it's general or specific should be clear from context.)

小狼

[mmmason8967]

...but the point is that informally, I use the copula when the subject/topic is implied.

I don't really follow this point. As I understand it, an i-adjective is to all intents and purposes a kind of limited verb. It conjugates, and it includes a "state of being"--that is, samui means "it is cold" rather than just "cold".

One of the limitations of i-adjectives compared to verbs is that the conjugation is limited and doesn't include a polite form. In order to speak politely, desu is added--not as a copula but simply as a way to raise the politeness level. It's more apparent in the past tense because the i-adjective conjugates but desu doesn't:-

samukatta desu.
It was cold.

With a na-adjective, on the other hand, desu functions as a copula and it does conjugate:-

shizuka deshita.
It was peaceful.

The upshot is that, as far as I know, you don't use a copula with i-adjectives: you can say "Samui" or "Samui desu" but you can't say "Samui da".

マイケル

[thegooseking]

マイケルさん、

I think you're right about that actually. I know you can say "Samui darou" and I'm not sure about things like "Samui da ne" and "Samui da yo", but yes, you can't have just "Samui da". My mistake.

小狼

[community.japanese]

rlankins1122286-san, kurokuma-san, 小狼san, マイケルsan,
thank you very much for helping each other in this forum!

The upshot is that, as far as I know, you don't use a copula with i-adjectives: you can say "Samui" or "Samui desu" but you can't say "Samui da".
マイケル

Very well spotted

Natsuko (奈津子),
Team JapanesePod101.com