The correct way to become embarrassed and red in the face

[mmmason8967]

私に赤面をさせました。
This expression is a bit tricky simply because we don't literally say it in this way. The expression is not wrong, but we would probably say;
私は顔が赤くなってしまいました。/顔が赤くなっちゃいました。(casual)
照れてしまいます。/照れちゃいます。(casual)

That answers one question but raises two more!

Both expressions use しまう as an auxiliary verb but I don't understand what effect it is having. I know that V-te shimau means that the verb has been completed or finished but that doesn't seem to make sense when the verb is about being embarrassed. So I guess しまう is having some other effect. But what is it?

In 「顔が赤くなる」 it looks like we are using an adverb. I'd expect 顔 to become 赤い, which is an adjective. Or is 赤く not an adverb?

マイケル

[ericf]

That answers one question but raises two more!

Both expressions use しまう as an auxiliary verb but I don't understand what effect it is having. I know that V-te shimau means that the verb has been completed or finished but that doesn't seem to make sense when the verb is about being embarrassed. So I guess しまう is having some other effect. But what is it?

In 「顔が赤くなる」 it looks like we are using an adverb. I'd expect 顔 to become 赤い, which is an adjective. Or is 赤く not an adverb?

マイケル

しまう = an action completed with regret. So it's like "alas/unfortunately my face became red"

You're right in that 赤い is an adjective and 赤くis an adverb. But 赤く is modifying なる not 顔 pre se - it's 赤くなる that modifies the face and makes it become red, if you see what I mean. Obviously the end result is an 赤い顔 but the sentence is relating the change rather than the result.

You could say "I was red faced" 顔が赤かった just like you do in English, but I don't think it's natural Japanese. When was the face red? In the past of course, but when in the past? Was it always red? Why? 顔が赤くなる addresses these better than 顔が赤かった.


Eric.

[mmmason8967]

Eric, thank you so much! That is an utterly brilliant explanation!

I wouldn't like to claim that I completely get it, but you've managed to point out very clearly the way in which the thinking behind the words is different to the way I'm used to thinking. I think I'm going to have another can of beer to celebrate...

Thanks again

マイケル

[natsukoy9313]

Thank you very much for perfect explanation, Eric-san!

Yes, like Eric-san wrote, しまう was used because having your face turn red is not what you intentionally did.
(If your face got red because of suntan whilst you were in the beach, maybe this was "intentional")

I bet "another can of beer" tasted better than 1st one...

Natsuko(奈津子),
Team JapanesePod101.com

[mmmason8967]

Yes, like Eric-san wrote, しまう was used because having your face turn red is not what you intentionally did.
(If your face got red because of suntan whilst you were in the beach, maybe this was "intentional")

So しまう implies that something happened to you involuntarily? Can you use it to say something like this?

昨日は、ヤギが社長を攻めました。笑いこけましてしまいました。

This is supposed to say "Yesterday a goat attacked the boss. I couldn't help laughing." That is, I was unable to stop myself from laughing even though it was inappropriate.

As it happens, the idea of my boss being attacked by a goat does, in fact, cause me a great deal of amusement.

I bet "another can of beer" tasted better than 1st one...

Yes, indeed. As Yotsuba might say: いつでも次の缶ビイルがいちばん楽しい缶ビイル。

マイケル

[ericf]

So しまう implies that something happened to you involuntarily? Can you use it to say something like this?

昨日は、ヤギが社長を攻めました。笑いこけましてしまいました。

This is supposed to say "Yesterday a goat attacked the boss. I couldn't help laughing." That is, I was unable to stop myself from laughing even though it was inappropriate.

Yes, and that example seems fine to me.

It can also be something perhaps a little less involuntary:

「ケーキ？」「もうなくなった。ごめん。実は、私、食べてしまいました。」
"Cake?" "It's already gone. Sorry. actually I'm afraid I ate it."

Presumably he/she didn't eat the whole cake, just whatever was left, not realising that not everybody had had a piece. The swine! Can you say that eating was "involuntary"? Maybe not eh!

しまう can also just mean something completed / finished / used up:
場面：駅前のスーパーの店内

何度も立ちどまってはあれこれ手にとって見ながら、ゆっくり通路を一巡する。カゴには焼きそばの玉と紋甲イカ、ブラックタイガーと白菜、きくらげとにんじんが入っている。ずいぶん時間をくってしまった。

食う（くう）is to eat, much more casual than 食べる and in this instance it's time that's being "eaten" or used up. I don't think there's particularly a sense of regret in this case, it's the "being used up completely" aspect of the meaning that's important.

Hope that makes some sort of sense.

And bonus points for anyone guessing the book/author that came from.

Eric.



PS For any unknown kanji/vocabulary in that you can always copy and paste into:
http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/cgi- ... dic.cgi?9T
and/or
http://www.popjisyo.com/WebHint/Portal_e.aspx

[mmmason8967]

Thanks, Eric. Your examples are very good illustrations of different uses for しまう and I think I'm beginning to get a feeling for how it works. So yes, it does indeed make some sort of sense!

In the second example I got the impression that the anonymous shopper was possibly killing time--maybe he or she had a long time to wait for his or her train and so they were taking their time, slowly selecting items in the supermarket. Or, then again, maybe they're simply the kind of shopper that I seem to run into every time I go to the supermarket...

No bonus points for me, I'm afraid. I haven't the slightest idea who the author is or which book the quotation came from. At present the books at my level tend to say 「にほんむかしぼなし」on the cover.

Thanks for the popjisyo link: that's a new one for me. I do use WWWJDIC quite a bit; another one I'm fond of is http://jisho.org/.

マイケル

[natsukoy9313]

マイケルさん、

Great example!! Yes, it is correct, like Eric-san said already.
Also, "reward" (= another tin of beer) is important to keep us motivated, right? I agree

エリックさん、
Good point! しまう、しまった is for involuntary, but you can also think that those are used for accidents too.
Sometimes it's actually just a expression of "gone already!".
So, if someone ate a cake, it could be by mistake or without noticing that someone else actually wanted it, it could be "an accident".
Perhaps, this person ate the cake BEFORE someone else takes is first. In that case, it's very much INTENTIONAL and not accident at all
Then s/he says もう食べちゃった（もう食べてしまったよ）, it simply means "unfortunately (for you? ), I already ate it".
By the way, when we say しまう for closing some place, it's actually a different story.
The verb しまう has a meaning of finish/end/terminate and also a meaning of keeping it somewhere safe or where it belongs.
Hope this helps a bit!

Natsuko(奈津子),
Team JapanesePod101.com

[mmmason8967]

Hope this helps a bit!

No. It helps a lot!　:wink:

Thanks to Eric and you, my failed attempt at saying "you're making me blush" has resulted in me learning about something very interesting indeed. Sometimes it's good to be wrong!

マイケル

[ericf]

Well, that's good to know!

Thanks for the jisho.org link by the way. It's quite a neat front end to JDICT.

Actually that passage was from a book with 日本語能力試験 blah blah on the cover! However, that particular exercise was an excerpt from a real book;
江國香織「コスモスの咲く庭」『つめたいよりに』新湖社
author 「title」 『 chapter』 publisher
It was the first time in a long while that all the family apart from him was out for the day. He ended up going to the supermarket; many years, it seems, since he'd done that, and was surprised by how many new and foreign produce on the shelves...

[natsukoy9313]

マイケルsan,
Good to know I could help a lot! Yes, it's good to be wrong sometimes, if the outcome is better!

So, appearently, no one got "bonus" point for getting the book title right
I'm very into language/linguistics, but somehow not at all in literature
Now I know the background story; I was kind of wondering why those stuff are named (we can find them easily at any supermarket).
It seems to be interesting!

Natsuko(奈津子),
Team JapanesePod101.com