Formal situations?

[the_haunted_boy]

I have a question, I do not know if its in the right part of the forum, if not then you can get rid of it.
I have considered doing one of those abroad programs for the summer, I would most likely be staying with a host family. My question is, should I use formal Japanese language when speaking with them? Would being too formal make things awkward when I will be staying with them?
I really do not want this to be like "The Simple Life" and have me look like a fool.

[Psy]

I'd say keep with the formal until your language is good enough to really be sure, but it will also depend on the family. The nice family I stayed with wouldn't allow me to be formal-- I was treated not as a guest but a fellow member, and was told on the first night fresh off the plane (and utterly overwhelmed) to nix the formalities when I tried saying "o-jama shimasu" the first time I entered their home. I helped with household chores, sometimes filled the bath (which was first-come, first-serve), and got an experience altogether different from what I'd heard about from other homestays.

Your mileage may vary!

[markystar]

one important thing that's very different from the west:

if they are older than you, always use polite japanese.

[the_haunted_boy]

one important thing that's very different from the west:

if they are older than you, always use polite japanese.

Yeah, that seems to be how a lot of the far east does things.
Do you know if there are ever any exceptions to that.

[markystar]

if there are, i am not nuanced enough to try. so i personally stick to that rule.

my friend's best friend for 10 years is 2 years older than him and he still uses polite japanese with him. they are best friends and talk every day. so the age thing is pretty important, i'd say.

[Psy]

one important thing that's very different from the west:

if they are older than you, always use polite japanese.

Good point, though it isn't limited to the East. It is (or I suppose was once) considered good manners to speak more politely to your elders, particularly by always addressing them by their last names. An Australian I met was somewhat aghast at the way modern American culture treats such things.

And yeah, age is important. It doesn't matter if you're 5 minutes apart as twins, one of is still otouto and will be treated is such.

[JonB]

Is that for real? I think that would be an exception - I don't understand a lot of the conversation when my Japanese friends use Japanese around me as it is all so informal...

[markystar]

i'll give you an example that might be helpful.

with my girlfriend's family, i speak casual to my girlfriend and her younger brother and sister. but always speak polite to her parents and grandmother.
her brother and sister mix casual and formal with me. but of course her parents and grandmother only use casual to me (because they are older than me). i think it would be a big no-no if i mistook their use of casual as an invitation for me to also do it. i always have to keep that formal one.

if i'm in a bar and meet someone for the first time, i start of with polite and let a few casual things slip out and see if they do it. if they start speaking casual to me then i completely switch to casual. if they switch back or waiver between the two, i'll do the same. i'll always take my lead from them.

now it also depends on people, some people are more casual that others. so it's really pretty complicated, but it's better to err on the side of politeness, i feel.

[JonB]

but if your best friend is older than you or your twin is 5 minutes older so you talk formal - I don't buy that.

If you can't talk casual to your best friend then he isn't much of a friend IMHO.

We had our neighbours over for dinner the other night - the husband is around the same age as me but his wife, who is about 10 years younger, spoke to my wife (the oldest in the group) always using chan etc - and i would not say they are that close.

[Psy]

but if your best friend is older than you or your twin is 5 minutes older so you talk formal - I don't buy that.

If you can't talk casual to your best friend then he isn't much of a friend IMHO.

We had our neighbours over for dinner the other night - the husband is around the same age as me but his wife, who is about 10 years younger, spoke to my wife (the oldest in the group) always using chan etc - and i would not say they are that close.

Woah woah, not quite what I meant. To clarify, I have a twin brother and as such he is only very slightly younger than me. Even though we are essentially the same age, when I speak with Japanese people I am still regarded as the "oniisan," where in an English conversation such a distinction is seldom made. My intention earlier was to use this to illustrate how strongly seniority is emphasized in Japan, not to suggest that you should adjust your speaking style to someone so closely related.

Sorry about that.

[thomasz]

In the general, you should talk politely to the older.