stressing of 'u' at the end of sentences

[petelechem]

I have recently been watching some japanese programmes and whilst watching, I noticed that sometimes the 'u' at the end of a sentence was stressed and other times it wasn't (therefore sounding more like 's'.

I have been working my way through the beginner podcasts and it always seems, for example, "Arigatou gozaimasu", is pronounced with the 'u' at the end, silent and tends to sort of extend the 's' sound.

However, in the programme I was watching the speaker tended to occassionally stress the 'u' at the end of the scentence, therefore making the 'su' sound at the end.

I was jut wondering if there was any specific reason for this.

Sorry if this is a really silly question.

Thanks in advance for you help.

[strugglebunny]

I'm no expert in Japanese, but I think it has to do with dialect.

My teacher (and so far the people I've heard on Japanese Pod 101 lesson) use a dialect (I think it's Tokyo) where the "u" and "i" get dropped sometimes, like suki sounds like "ski", desu sounds like "dess.." and watashitachi sounds like "watash-tachi" (no middle "i"on the shi syllable. But, I've also heard native speakers pronounce every syllable like "de-su", "su-ki", and "wa-ta-shi-ta-chi"

I think what it all boils down to is how you want to sound. There's really no right or wrong.

Anyone can feel free to correct if I'm wrong.

[Belton]

My understanding of this is that this is the standard Tokyo dialect that is the national model now, and as such probably the best one to emulate when learning. Where I've noticed exceptions is when someone seems to be emphasising something -spelling things out, annoyed etc.
Unlike with most people with regional accents in English, Japanese I've met seem to be able to switch at will from Standard to their local dialect. And find it very odd that I can't speak in an American accent so they can understand me more easily.

—from a textbook (Colloquial Japanese, Clarke & Hamamura, Routlidge 1987)

Devoicing of vowels
The vowels i and e are often devoiced, that is whispered, when they occur between voiceless consonants or after a voiceless consonant and before a pause. The voiceless consonants are p, f, t, ts, ch, s, sh, k, and h. ...
...eg. kikimasu: — k_kimas_, 'to hear'
desu: — des_, 'is'
kakuto: — kak_to, 'whenever I write'
The u in desu and the ending ~masu tends to be replaced by a slight lengthening of the preceding -s- not only before a pause but also before the sentence particle ne, 'isn't that so'.

The one I always noticed was kutsushita (socks) becoming k_ts_sh_ta almost no voiced vowels at all.

The most noticeable are desu, masu and shita,

But like with pitch accent it's probably best to find a model recording and emulate that than to try to remember rules.

[markystar]

this has nothing to with dialect...
the same phenomenon occurs in all dialects.

in fact, in other dialects, other vowels get dropped and consonants get dropped.
there's not much regularity to it, besides they "weak vowels" /i/ and /u/.

[Fedgrub]

On the podcasts, I assume they pronounce the word without dropping any vowels just in case you are writing along or something, and to prevent you from getting confused or falling into a bad habit from the start. Not that dropping vowels is a bad habit, but if you get confused with it early you may get into a bad habit early and drop all the wrong parts of the word and have it mean something completely different!!

[petelechem]

Thanks for all the replies guys,

that's helped me understand it a bit better.

[Fedgrub]

Anytime!

[urabito1741]

Re: Dropping Final U vs. Fully Pronouncing It

Can anyone confirm (or correct my possible misunderstanding) that pronouncing (i.e., audibly vocalizing) the final "u" (in "desu," for example) is more common among (or by) females than males?

For instance, Alpha-Male Kazunori's manhood might be in question if he were habitually to sound every single syllable of the nonpast affirmative copula (DE-SU).

What do you think, Peter-san?

BTW, what ever became of Kazunori?

[racum]

Last year when I was visiting Japan I stopped by in Fukushima for a couple of days, at that time I was only in "Survival Phrases" level... but I was able to notice the manager of the hotel, a very outgoing old lady, stressing the "u" in "desu" and similar things... I also notice that she was kind of "singing" the words.

That was the only case I can recall... all the other japanese people I know (including native and the brazilian colony) usually drop the minor phonetic fragments.