とき + ために

[Brody]

Sorry, I'm full of questions.

パパがあっちの星に行ったときママに<b>会うためには</b>、どうしてもおまえがママのことを憶えていてくれないといけないんだ。
My question regards the use of "tame niwa." In this sentence, does it apply to "Itta toki," or "Oboeteite..."

Because both could make sense in context: "When I/Papa goes to the star to meet Mama, you have to remember Mama for me no matter what," or "When I go to the star, you have to remember Mama for me no matter what, so that I/we will meet her."

Does toki have any influence over tame (I would expect tame to come before toki if it were to be, "When I go to the star to meet Mommy." Still, I don't know

I'm leaning towards the former translation, in that the use of the comma and wa seems to group the tame with the first half of the sentence, but I'd really like a second opinion. Neither translation would mar the story but I'm after absolute comprehension.

Thanks.

[Bueller_007]

Sorry, I'm full of questions.

パパがあっちの星に行ったときママに<b>会うためには</b>、どうしてもおまえがママのことを憶えていてくれないといけないんだ。
My question regards the use of "tame niwa." In this sentence, does it apply to "Itta toki," or "Oboeteite..."

Because both could make sense in context: "When I/Papa goes to the star to meet Mama, you have to remember Mama for me no matter what," or "When I go to the star, you have to remember Mama for me no matter what, so that I/we will meet her."

Does toki have any influence over tame (I would expect tame to come before toki if it were to be, "When I go to the star to meet Mommy." Still, I don't know

I'm leaning towards the former translation, in that the use of the comma and wa seems to group the tame with the first half of the sentence, but I'd really like a second opinion. Neither translation would mar the story but I'm after absolute comprehension.

Thanks.

That's a weird-as-hell sentence.

Where did you get it, and what is the context?

[Brody]

It's from a novel, いま、会いにゆきます (a simple, innocent, beautiful story)

Context is that a man's wife has died, leaving him with his six-year-old son. The son and father are talking about where people go when they pass on. The father has made up a story that people go to this "star/planet"星 when they die and that they can only stay there if people on Earth remember them. I understand the sentence. It means that one day the dad will die and go to the star and so he wants his son to remember about the dad and mom.

I'm just a little confused about the syntax and grammar of the sentence.

who does the 会うためには apply to? Is it the father, in that "When I (Papa) go to the star, to meet Mama," or does it apply to the son, "You must remember Mama for me no matter what so that you can meet/see Mama" ???

thanks.

[Jason]

From the context, I would say it's most likely referring to Papa being able to see Mama. It's talking about when Papa goes to the star, so it doesn't really make much sense for it to be meant for the child.

[Bueller_007]

From the context, I would say it's most likely referring to Papa being able to see Mama. It's talking about when Papa goes to the star, so it doesn't really make much sense for it to be meant for the child.

I was thinking that it might be a warning to the child that after the father dies (his warm memories of mother disappearing with him), if the child doesn't remember his mother fondly, the child won't be able to meet her when he/she dies.

"Once I've gone to that star, you have to remember your mother fondly, no matter what happens. Otherwise, you won't be able to meet her (after you die.)"

But of course, when the child dies, his memories will disappear, along with both of his parents. So using it as a warning in this way doesn't make sense. (The father's story is much more depressing than it first appears, no?)

Also, he uses "くれない", which makes it sound like a favor done for the father's sake. (Do Japanese parents even use くれない when talking to their own children? Sounds too polite.) So yes, I would say 会うためには refers to the father, not the child.

パパがあっちの星に行ったときママに会うためには、どうしてもおまえがママのことを憶えていてくれないといけないんだ。
"Once I've gone to that star, you have to remember your mother fondly, no matter what. Otherwise, I won't be able to meet her."

I guess that's how I'd translate it.

[Brody]

Appreciate the responses. Yeah, I too think it refers to the father, pretty much only because it comes before the comma. If I went by context alone I would actually think it would refer to both of them. Maybe it's just a confusing sentence.